Simons was founded in 1840 by John Simons in Quebec City. It is Canada's oldest private family business, with 15 Simons stores, nine in Quebec, including its head office in Quebec City, three in Alberta, one in British Columbia, and two in Ontario. My guest in this exclusive interview is Simon's new CEO, Bernard Leblanc. After launching his business career at Simons, then a stint abroad, Bernard came back to Quebec City, assuming several key roles until ultimately being offered the leadership of this iconic Canadian retailer.
Welcome to The Voice of Retail. I'm your host Michael LeBlanc. This podcast is brought to you in conjunction with Retail Council of Canada.
For the first time in its 180 year history, La Maison Simon, better known as Simons, based in Quebec City, will be led by a non-family member as CEO. And you are about to meet him.
Simons was founded in 1840 by John Simons in Quebec City. It is Canada's oldest private family business, with 15 Simons stores, nine in Quebec, including its head office in Quebec City, three in Alberta, one in British Columbia, and two in Ontario.
My guest in this exclusive interview is Simon's new CEO, Bernard Leblanc. After launching his business career at Simons, then a stint abroad, Bernard came back to Quebec City, assuming several key roles until ultimately being offered the leadership of this iconic Canadian retailer.
In a wide-ranging interview, we talk about his career journey, plans for Simons, and how the COIVD era may have changed retail. Still, the fundamentals continue to create remarkable connections with consumers.
Thanks for tuning into this special episode of The Voice of Retail. If you haven’t already, be sure and click subscribe on your favourite podcast platform so new episodes will land automatically twice a week, and check out my other retail industry media properties; the Remarkable Retail podcast, the Conversations with CommerceNext podcast, and the Food Professor podcast. Last but not least, if you are into BBQ, check out my all new YouTube barbecue show, Last Request Barbeque, with new episodes each and every week!
I’m your host Michael LeBlanc, President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company & Maven Media, and if you’re looking for more content, or want to chat follow me on LinkedIn, or visit my website meleblanc.co! Have a safe week everyone!
About Bernard
With more than 25 years of experience as a multidisciplinary leader, he has worked at La Maison Simons as Merchandise Manager (1994-2000) and Vice President of Operations (2015-2020), and most recently as Executive Vice President and Chief Operating Officer (2020-2022), where he was involved in strategic planning and governance, management of several departments and stores, as well as supply chain and facilities management. In 2022, he was appointed President and Chief Executive Officer. For the first time in its rich history, Canada's oldest privately held family business is not led by a member of the Simons family.
Over the course of his career, Bernard has held several key positions that have allowed him to develop strong expertise in operations management, retail network development, product development, procurement, and supply chain management.
Prior to returning to La Maison Simons in 2015, he spent 15 years with BRP, including six years in Europe, where he was Vice President and Regional General Manager responsible for Western Europe, Middle East and Africa, and three years in Asia, where he served as Director of Strategic Sourcing.
Bernard holds a Bachelor of Commerce degree, with a major in International Business and a minor in Finance, obtained with great distinction from Concordia University.
About Michael
Michael is the Founder & President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company Inc and a Senior Advisor to Retail Council of Canada as part of his advisory and consulting practice. He brings 25+ years of brand/retail/marketing & eCommerce leadership experience and has been on the front lines of retail industry change for his entire career. He has delivered keynotes, hosted fire-side discussions with C-level executives and participated on thought leadership panels worldwide. Michael was recently added to ReThink Retail’s prestigious Top 100 Global Retail Influencers for a second year in 2022.
Michael is also the producer and host of a network of leading podcasts, including Canada’s top retail industry podcast, The Voice of Retail, plus the Remarkable Retail with author Steve Dennis, Global E-Commerce Tech Talks and The Food Professor with Dr. Sylvain Charlebois. Most recently, Michael launched Conversations with CommerceNext, a podcast focussed on retail eCommerce, digital marketing and retail careers - all available on Apple, Spotify, Amazon Music and all major podcast platforms. Michael is also the producer and host of the “Last Request Barbeque” channel on YouTube where he cooks meals to die for and influencer riches.
Michael LeBlanc 00:05
Welcome to The Voice of Retail. I'm your host Michael LeBlanc, and this podcast is brought to you in conjunction with Retail Council of Canada. For the first time in its 180-year history, La Maison Simons, better known as Simons, based in Quebec City, will be led by a non-family member as CEO. You're about to meet him.
Michael LeBlanc 00:20
Simons was founded in 1840 by John Simons in Quebec City. It is Canada's oldest private family business with 15 Simons stores. My guest in this exclusive interview is Simon's new CEO, Bernard Leblanc. After launching his business career at Simons, then a stint abroad, Bernard came back to Quebec City, assuming several key roles until ultimately being offered the leadership of this iconic Canadian retailer.
Michael LeBlanc 00:45
In a wide-ranging interview, we talk about his career journey, plans for Simons, and how the COVID-era may have changed retail, yet the fundamentals continue to create remarkable connections with consumers.
Bernard Leblanc 00:57
Sometimes we, we, we put, we, we think that fancy gadgets, and, and bells and whistles are what's going to make it different. I don't believe in that. I think people are still just looking for a good, authentic, and, and, and, and, and heartwarming human connection.
Michael LeBlanc 01:13
Let's listen in now. Bernard, welcome to The Voice of Retail podcast.
How are you doing this afternoon?
Bernard Leblanc 01:19
Very well. Thank you for having me.
Michael LeBlanc 01:21
Well, thank you so much for joining me. It's a big, busy week in your life. There's a, a big announcement we're going to talk about. And where am I finding you today, where abouts are you coming to me from?
Bernard Leblanc 01:29
I'm actually in Quebec City, at, at head office.
Michael LeBlanc 01:33
Let's jump right in. Tell us a bit about yourself, your background, you have such an interesting background, you've got both Canadian, lots of Canadian, global experience, and your current role, which is a new role at Simons.
Bernard Leblanc 01:46
Sure. Well, I, I'm on my second cycle at, at Simons. In fact, I was with the company back in the, in the 90's more in a, in a merchant type role, where I was responsible for a group of buyers, and also working with our product development team, and design team, on all of our exclusive product. And then I had the opportunity to go and, and join BRP, the Recreational Products Group of Bombardier, at the time, and, and which became BRP afterwards.
Bernard Leblanc 02:20
And, and had a, a pretty diverse career there. Started in, in a division that was building technical apparel and, and accessories, and then moved on more to manufacturing and, and, and sourcing operations in different, in different product categories. And, and that brought me overseas to Asia, to head up the, the business, the business there.
Bernard Leblanc 02:46
And, and to Europe as a General Manager, and then back to Canada, at which time, once I, once I was back, it was just at the point where Simons was expanding nationally, and it was an opportunity for me. Checked in with Peter to see how he was doing; life throws funny things at you sometimes. We, we, frankly, both decided that it'd be, kind of, nice to work together again.
Bernard Leblanc 03:10
And, and so I came back to the company in 2015. And I've been here since, since then overseeing operations. And, and just recently, as of two days ago, took on the role of President and CEO which I'm, I'm honored to have the opportunity to, to take on.
Michael LeBlanc 03:29
The, it's fantastic news. I mean, the first family member, non-family member. So, I want to get into that and, and talk about how you guys see governance, and how you see the operations, and, and all that great stuff. Now, did you always want to be in business? Like sometimes retail is described as the accidental career.
Michael LeBlanc 03:45
You've, kind of, gone back and forth into, into retail, certainly connected to product, but, you know, when you were growing up, is this something you always wanted to do? Or, how did you find yourself here?
Bernard Leblanc 03:56
You know, can, can I say always wanted? Perhaps not. However, I did, I did work in retail while I was in school. And so, you know, I enjoy, I have a service mindset, I enjoy being with people. I, I like serving customers and, and, and discovering their, their needs and trying to respond to it. So, I guess, you know, that, that's part of my personality. And obviously with a, with a service organization such as Simons there's, there's a great fit there in terms of values.
Bernard Leblanc 04:28
And, and, you know, I'm, I'm originally from Montreal, I moved to Quebec City in, in the early 90's. My wife is from Quebec City. She's, she's a, a true, a true Quebec City girl. And so, you know, when, when, when I came into Quebec City, I was just, in fact, I had worked, then gone back to university and I finished my, my bachelor’s degree, and, and decided to, to just come and knock on the door at Simons because I, just because of the reputation, frankly.
Michael LeBlanc 05:00
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 05:00
To see whether there'd be something interesting for me to do. And so, that's how I, I came to the company originally. Providence has a, has a, has a nice way of working sometimes.
Michael LeBlanc 05:11
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 05:11
It's a company I've, I've always loved and, and, and profoundly enjoyed. So, I, I, I'm, I'm glad to have the opportunity to, to work in retail, and to work in, what I would consider to be, the best company in retail. My background is, you know, my, my educational background is in business. I have a bachelor’s degree in Commerce, with a major in international business and a minor in finance.
Bernard Leblanc 05:34
So, and that's what brought me to, you know, to have that, that 15-year pause in the middle. I was really seeking to have more international experience and, and, and being more of a, of a Canadian company at Simons, it was just an opportunity for me to, to, to explore more international boundaries, more complex cultural environments, and so on.
Michael LeBlanc 05:58
Sure.
Bernard Leblanc 05:58
So, so that's, that's what, what, that's the short story, I guess, around what has, has brought me here today.
Michael LeBlanc 06:06
Well, let's talk about, let's talk about Simons. So, pretty much no one listening to this podcast would not know the name, though they might not know enough about the brand. So, just give me the, the basics, the, you know, your head office based in Quebec City, and recently, I don't know, in the past decade expanded beyond that, but how many stores, where do you operate, and what makes Simons different?
Bernard Leblanc 06:28
Okay. Well, what people may not know is, in fact, Simons is the oldest privately held family business in Canada.
Michael LeBlanc 06:36
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 06:36
It was founded in 1840. So, we're just turning the page on 182 years of history. As you pointed out earlier, I'm the first non-family member to take the lead of the company. So, that is, a certainly, again, you know, a huge vote of confidence. The, the current footprint of the company, in fact, we have 15 stores across Canada, soon 16, because we are opening a brand-new store in Fairview Pointe Claire on the west island of Montreal.
Bernard Leblanc 07:06
Our, our stores, so we have 10 stores in Quebec, in the province of Quebec. So, in Quebec City, in Sherbrooke in the Montreal area, in Gatineau, as well. And we have our stores outside of, outside of Quebec, in Ontario, Alberta and BC. So, Ottawa and Mississauga for the stores in, in Ontario.
Michael LeBlanc 07:31
Right in my backyard.
Bernard Leblanc 07:32
Two stores in Edmonton, one in Calgary, and one on the west end of Vancouver, Hyde Park Row.
Michael LeBlanc 07:40
It took the business; it took the business a while to expand even out of Quebec City. I remember thinking, you know, a long, great, history. Talk about that a little bit, was it, was it a measure twice, cut once, kind of, idea? Or was it at the, at one point, listen, we need, we need to go national, we need scale and scope. And, and we've done what we can do in the province of Quebec.
Bernard Leblanc 08:01
I think there's, there's, the latter of what you said is probably the closest to, to what was going on. It was this, this element of, you know, in order to really compete with the big players in the industry, and the fact that, you know, the competition was quickly becoming global with, with large players like H&M, and, and, and Zara, you know, enter, being very, very active and present in the marketplace.
Bernard Leblanc 08:24
If you didn't have scale and scope, there was really, it was extremely difficult to really compete with, with some of those massive global players.
Michael LeBlanc 08:33
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 08:33
The, the infrastructure, the, the, the ecosystem probably got even worse when we had, you know, the tech giants come in, and, and, and making that scale and scope even bigger. So, so that was, that was a, a, a, starting point. There's also, you know, it was just a matter of being able to, to, to master, have the, have the talent pool, I guess, to be able to master what we had as a footprint.
Bernard Leblanc 08:59
And it's a, it's a big change for a company that's always been very regional. It was a big decision to go outside of Quebec City. And that actually happened during my first tenure with the company. So, you know, it's not that, it's not that ancient that this—
Michael LeBlanc 09:14
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 09:14
Company was only around the three stores in Quebec City. And so, you know, it took some time to, to make our, to, to become confident, confident enough that, that the brand would, would resonate outside of, of Quebec City—
Michael LeBlanc 09:29
And the merchandise, right. I mean, the merchandise assortment that you might have in Quebec, more influenced perhaps by Europe than, than the west. Do you, do you think, do you, do you, is it, is that part of it? Are we confident that the merchandise that we offer in Quebec is going to be as popular in Edmonton as it is here, is that, is that—
Bernard Leblanc 09:47
Right. Well, we've taken the orientation of, of offering the same product assortment across, across all of our locations and, and to have a pretty, pretty tight alignment even between what we offer online and, and, and in-store. And, and to the exception of our marketplace assortment. But even there we remain extremely curated to, to ensure that it's true brand.
Bernard Leblanc 10:12
The unique part of our assortment is the fact that there's 70%, roughly, of our, of our product assortment that is exclusive, that we've developed in-house. We have a team of over 100 designers and, and, and technical people, here in Quebec City, that actually design and develop our product.
Bernard Leblanc 10:32
And, and our, our merchant group is here also, at head office. And, you know, there's a big, big focus on, on building things that you can only find at Simons.
Michael LeBlanc 10:43
Yeah, it's interesting because, we used to have, we discussed this a lot when I was at The Shopping Channel, now Today's Shopping Choice, where we would offer brands that were, you know, not well known, but great product versus we needed, we felt like we needed, a couple of brands that would drive traffic because they were well known.
Michael LeBlanc 11:00
Do you, do you, how do you conceptualize that? I mean, taking the exclusive route that you have is a longer view, right. It feels like a long view to building success. You have a lot of control, but you also don't have the big names that sometimes can draw the traffic, yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 11:15
True. I think we've been able to have a good mix, our merchant team is always trying to find upcoming, innovative, creative brands that, that complement our assortment. There, there's a mix of, you know, designer brands in our assortment, as well as well-known national brands, and, and complemented by emerging brands, really, newcomers to the marketplace.
Michael LeBlanc 11:45
Right. It's, it's balancing that, that blend, right.
Bernard Leblanc 11:48
Right, right exactly.
Michael LeBlanc 11:49
The art and science of running what you run, right, that's the—
Bernard Leblanc 11:53
Precisely and, and we integrate it with, you know, our, our, our assortment in terms of designer merchandise, and there's some very good, you know, value price basics in our assortment, as well. So, we, you know, we try to go to a full gamut.
Bernard Leblanc 12:08
And, and there's a, a pretty broad client base that, that comes to Simons, from, from the younger shopper all the way through to a more mature shopper. So, we try to have merchandise that can cater right across the spectrum.
Michael LeBlanc 12:21
So, when you think about, let's talk about governance for a little bit. Now that you've got, I, I understand that Peter, who I've, who's been a guest on my podcast, great interview, is still having a very active role. Did I understand that he's stepping into more of the merchant role, and just talk about how the governance is going to work as you guys see it.
Bernard Leblanc 12:39
Absolutely.
Michael LeBlanc 12:40
Not really a governance podcast, but I'm just, kind of, curious about on a day-to-day, month-to-month basis, how you're conceptualizing this change.
Bernard Leblanc 12:46
I think it's an important part of success as well, especially for me as a, as a non-family CEO, to have a solid governance in place to understand where every, everyone's role and, and, and—
Michael LeBlanc 12:59
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 12:59
Influence starts and stops. So, to, to the first part of your question, relative to Peter's role going forward, he is taking on the role of Chief Merchant. He was already very active in that role; he was actually doing two jobs at once.
Michael LeBlanc 13:14
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 13:14
And, you know, this is, is really an area where he's, he's extremely strong and very, very competent. It is also, I would say, the, the, the most strategic part of our business is really where that product assortment and the brand resonance comes to life. And it is been, it has been, and, and continues to be part of our success. And, and therefore, you know, I think he'll have a, a great, a great influence on how the brand comes to life.
Bernard Leblanc 13:50
Both his, his brother, Richard, is also part of the buying team. And, and so, you know, having the two brothers in the merchant group has me, you know, stepping into, with me stepping into this new role, I couldn't dream of a better, of a better situation. I have access to both of them. It takes some of the, some of the tension off and, and makes things maybe a little less stressful coming into the new role.
Michael LeBlanc 14:15
I mean, it is such a case study, because it is often the case, that it's one of those moments, those inflection moments in a business, right, where there's a transition, whether it's succession, or whether it's change leadership, but particularly in a, in a family run business where they, where they change that leadership profile. So, it's so, it's going to be so interesting to watch. I mean, I think you're all so skilled. I think you're going to write a case study for this around the world, so.
Bernard Leblanc 14:41
Imagine, imagine how you feel once, you know, being the one that follows five generations.
Michael LeBlanc 14:47
Right, right, right. Yeah, exactly.
Bernard Leblanc 14:49
So, that, that's where I was saying it's so, it's so precious to be, to have, to, to be able to make this change in the context where they, they're still fully engaged. And, and just for people to understand, like this, these are not owners that just show up once a week to the office—
Michael LeBlanc 15:03
No.
Bernard Leblanc 15:04
Like these guys are here, and they—
Michael LeBlanc 15:05
They're all in, they're all in, yeah. They're all in.
Bernard Leblanc 15:05
They're all in, right. So, and, and they remain the sole owners of the organization. So, both Peter and Richard are, are the controlling shareholders. So, they're, they're fully engaged financially, as well. And, and they’re, you know, you were referring to governance, we have strengthened our corporate governance.
Bernard Leblanc 15:25
On the one hand, we have a very strong advisory board with independent members and, and an independent chairman, that, that leads the, the advisory board. It's an advisory board, but quite frankly I, I've seen, you know, Boards of Directors in public companies in my career and, and we, we work with this board exactly as if it was a full fiduciary board.
Bernard Leblanc 15:51
Because I think it sets, it sets the tone in terms of guidance, in terms of ensuring that we, we, you know, we control the, the objectives, and the, and, and, and the future of the organization and make sure that, that the leadership, myself, plus the rest of the executive team, is delivering on the objectives and the ambitions that the family has for the business.
Michael LeBlanc 16:18
You know, it's, it's, it's a very savvy approach. I just interviewed the McKinsey lead. She's actually Canadian, who just wrote a book called "CEO Excellence", and they tried to map out in the book, it's actually a really good book, and it's an interesting interview about what are the defining six characteristics that, that lead to CEO excellence.
Michael LeBlanc 16:36
And one of the biggest ones we talked about was managing the board to be advisors to the business. And it's what, exactly what you're saying, right. Take advantage of a board that is not just, you know, not just there for, for all the other basic governance, but leverage them and, and work with them, so that they become valued advisors to the business. Which isn't, you know, pouring on tons of stacks and hundreds of pages of stuff.
Bernard Leblanc 17:00
Clearly.
Michael LeBlanc 17:01
It's, it's more philosophical, I would say, than it is operational, it's—
Bernard Leblanc 17:06
We have, we have the privilege of having, you know, huge experience on, on our board with individuals that, that bring tremendous value. So, and that's part of, of the recipe for success, I think, from a, from a management perspective.
Michael LeBlanc 17:06
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 17:18
The family has also put in place a family council, in order to establish, kind of, the objectives that they, that they see for themselves going forward. Peter mentioned in some of the interviews that we gave together this week, you know, and I thought, I thought it was pretty illustrative of, of how they feel, as well, their name is on the door.
Michael LeBlanc 17:43
Right.
Bernard Leblanc 17:43
So, fundamentally, they want to make sure that their values and, and, and, and their intent is well represented—
Michael LeBlanc 17:49
Right.
Bernard Leblanc 17:51
In the way the, the business is managed. And that we're going to market and that we're servicing our clients in line with what the family is, holds true to, in terms of their own, their own—
Michael LeBlanc 18:03
Principles, their principles, operating their principles. I mean, and, you know, listen, we have in Canada, an example of a family run business, retailer, that, that was not successful in this transition. But I think you've got so many of the parts right that I'm very confident.
Michael LeBlanc 18:17
Let's talk about retail. Let's get, let's talk about, what does innovation look like in the department store sector? Like, is it format, service, product, is it all of those things? As you know, the department store, I don't know, I'm not even sure if you call yourself a department store. So, let's start there. But what does innovation look like to you?
Bernard Leblanc 18:35
Right. I, I, I'm not sure I would qualify us as a department store. I think I would, I would, I would maybe say larger format, specialty store. Is maybe how I would try to, I think we fall in a, in a space that's, that's perhaps undefined. Maybe that sounds corny, but that's, I think, we, we've got somewhat of a unique space, in how we, in how we deploy. And the future, I think you touched on a lot of elements that, that are extremely important.
Bernard Leblanc 19:05
You, you probably know, and maybe your listeners know that, you know, each of our locations is unique. We, we try and create an environment that's, that's interesting, that's architecturally strong, that brings the arts to life as well within our, our, our store environment. And, and, and that is put together in order to optimize the space in which we're building the store.
Bernard Leblanc 19:30
So, it's not about just taking a square box and putting a bunch of stuff in it. There's, there's a really thoughtful exercise in building beautiful space, and building something that's, that's, that's unique for its environment and so on. So, I think that's part of, certainly part of our recipe, and, and, and I believe we're seeing our customers come back, you know, post-pandemic. It's, it's great to see people back to the store.
Bernard Leblanc 19:56
And then, so, you know, we want to create a beautiful environment where people enjoy spending time, in that, in that environment. Service is, is the number one component for us. It's very, very central. The customer is at the very center of every single decision and, and, and, and opportunity that we look at.
Bernard Leblanc 20:18
And, and that needs to survive, it's been there for 182 years and, and will remain. We're there for the customer and, and that's where our, our vision comes to life. So, we need to continue to develop our teams to be able to be the, the best service people in the industry, to be knowledgeable. The reality is customers are, are more and more knowledgeable as they come in-store today.
Michael LeBlanc 20:42
Yeah, yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 20:42
So, so we have to be able to respond to, to that knowledge and make sure that we're, we're, we're respectful of the fact that sometimes they know more than, than our salespeople know, and therefore—
Michael LeBlanc 20:53
Do you see, question for you, do you see great service as table stakes, or can you make it a differentiator in the business?
Bernard Leblanc 21:00
You know, in this world where, you know, everything goes through a device of sorts, I think that, well, I'll go, I'll step back one minute. Where, I think it is a table stake. However, I think that you can step it up in a context of being authentic, kind, truly helpful to people, and not in the context of trying to just sell stuff, but really accompany the customer in their journey.
Bernard Leblanc 21:28
And it seems simple, but it is not. That, that, that authentic, genuine, human connection, being interested by the individual that you're speaking to. You know, being able to spend true quality time. I often refer to it with our teams as encapsulating your, your moment with that customer, right.
Bernard Leblanc 21:50
Just being, imagining you're alone on, you know, on the floor, just with that one person, and, and being able to give them all of your attention, and all your time. So, you know, there's a differentiator in being able to be truly connected, and truly attentive, to what's going on with each and every customer, at each and every visit.
Bernard Leblanc 22:11
And, and so, in that context, I think it can be a really true differentiator. And, and to not let, sometimes we, we put, we, we think that fancy gadgets and, and bells and whistles are what's going to make it different. I don't believe in that. I think people are still just looking for good, authentic and heartwarming, human connection. And if you can really drive that, that, that, it's subtle, right.
Michael LeBlanc 22:41
Yeah, yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 22:41
It's that subtlety and that, and that interconnection. If you can find that subtlety, I think it, it, what's, it's what we, we strive for.
Michael LeBlanc 22:48
I've often, I've often characterized, in fact, I was, I was doing a media interview today, and, and it was on the future of shopping centers. So, I want to talk to you about that. But I was talking to the reporter that retail really, very, at a very, very high level can sometimes be conceptualized as two bifurcated elements.
Michael LeBlanc 23:07
So, you've got experience and efficiency, and luxury and value. And what you're describing is the more experiential. But you, you've also invested significant amounts of time, effort, and treasure, you personally as well, in e-commerce, which is, you know, there to be efficient, it's a different kind of service level.
Bernard Leblanc 23:22
Absolutely. So, so maybe this is a great segue to talk about my vision for frontier-less commerce.
Michael LeBlanc 23:25
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 23:29
And that is a term that I've been using heavily in, with our teams, but I, I've talked to the media this week about that concept. And, you know, some are saying, well, it's just, it's just another way to call omni-channel. I say no, no, no, it is very different, in my mind, from omni-channel. It's pushing it one, one step further, in, in which there's a, a unified customer journey and a unified customer experience, regardless of where and how the customer engages with you.
Bernard Leblanc 23:58
And, and therefore, whether they're coming through the website, or whether they're coming through social media, or other types of technologies that might, that may emerge over time, or that they end up in-store, how do you interconnect all of those touch points from the customer's perspective to eliminate all breaches in, in, in continuity.
Bernard Leblanc 24:19
And today, people will pre-shop online, maybe they'll buy a few items online, they'll put a few on the side that they want to go see in store. But there's a break in continuity, because they have to go to store and then they have to ask somebody to find those items that they—
Michael LeBlanc 24:34
Start all over again, basically.
Bernard Leblanc 24:35
And, and they start all over again. So, how, imagine if we were able to make that journey completely seamless, and once you came into the store, we already knew what you had been looking for and that we had potentially pre-prepared it, or made it available for you as you stepped into the store. So, so, I think that there's a way to really push it, and, and obviously it's not something that we, that we are prepared for tomorrow morning.
Michael LeBlanc 25:04
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 25:04
But there's that, I think there are tremendous opportunities for us to really bring that concept to life where there, there's this really, really seamless journey, like truly seamless journey. We talk about, you know, buy-online-pick-up-in-store, buy-online-return-in-store, what about buy-in-store-return-online, or, you know, all sorts of permutations—
Michael LeBlanc 25:28
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 25:28
Around that, and, and, and just making it so seamless that everything talks to each other and that, you know, there really isn't any, we, we eliminate every single friction point that exists from a customer perspective. So, frontier-less commerce—
Michael LeBlanc 25:43
I love that idea. I love that idea, frontier-less commerce. I mean, basically, you know, as I've been thinking about it, it's, it, retail whether it's bought online, bought in store, it's becoming a distinction without a difference, right, from many perspectives.
Bernard Leblanc 25:57
In, in the end it's, it's, it's retail or commerce, or, you know, call, call it whichever way you want. But the, the reality is you're, you're responding to a customer need and making their experiences as, as, as fabulous as possible, and, and as memorable as possible. And so, what is it going to take in today's world to be able to deliver that, well, I think there's, there are still, you know, many, many opportunities that we can collectively work on to be able to, to bring that journey to life.
Michael LeBlanc 26:29
Let's talk about, let's talk about shopping malls for a bit. It's just on my mind. I was talking about it to some journalists today, he was writing an article on the future. So, as a, not all your locations are in shopping malls, but certainly you have a, a major piece of that.
Michael LeBlanc 26:44
Major, you have a major presence in shopping malls. Like how are you thinking about the modern shopping mall? What's it going to take, from your perspective as an anchor to see, innovate, what does innovation look like in shopping malls to you? And, and what do they need to do, the operators, to, to keep or stay relevant in your mind?
Bernard Leblanc 27:02
Right. Well, many have already engaged in, in, in some form of transformation, in order to make it more of a multi, multidisciplinary experience, I guess. And, and ensuring that, that it's a destination where people can be entertained, potentially be, have access to other types of services, be able to have high quality restaurants, and I'm not talking about just a nifty renovated food court and—
Michael LeBlanc 27:36
More bespoke, like at Square One, right. More bespoke like your location at Square One there.
Bernard Leblanc 27:41
Exactly, you know, being able to have a diversity, as well as activities, and, and, and offering from a, from a commercial perspective. You know, is there, is there some, some, some like true entertainment facilities that integrate the mall of the future. And, and I'm interested to find out whether, you know, the interconnectivity between office space and, and, and living space, as well, will, kind of, all come to coexist.
Michael LeBlanc 28:10
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 28:11
So, a lot of redevelopments happening around legacy malls, I'll be interested to shop—
Michael LeBlanc 28:18
Live, work, play, shop thing, right. That—
Bernard Leblanc 28:21
I'm sorry, say again.
Michael LeBlanc 28:22
That live, work, play, shop, kind of integration, you know. Like we see at, at The Well or in Hudson Yards, are these big properties that put it all together, right.
Bernard Leblanc 28:30
Right, right, and integrate that with, with modern transit systems and, you know, some of the, the, the, I think of what's going on in Burnaby or Oak Ridge where, you know, they're redeveloping legacy shopping malls into, into multi-use residential, office plus, you know, they're, they're, they're, they're built around a transit transportation infrastructure for, for public transit.
Bernard Leblanc 29:00
So, there's a really, really interesting, and, and some of the, I segue to how things are in Asia or in Europe. You know, there's a lot of that that exists already in other parts of the world. I think that we have, just given the fact that we've always been able to, to benefit from a lot more space than many countries, I think we haven't been as innovative as potentially we could be, and, and, and, and engaging more densely in terms of how we, how we bring architecture to life.
Michael LeBlanc 29:30
Last question for you, second last question. Thinking about your retail strategy pre-COVID, in the before time, versus how you see it today, what, what in your mind has changed? When I think about, I think of both acceleration of trends, you know, e-commerce, thanks to the COVID-era, but I also imagine things, some things have changed.
Michael LeBlanc 29:47
Maybe the way we work has changed and that has a, a fairly material impact on, I suspect, on both assortment, and location, and all those things. How are you thinking about post, maybe too early to call post-COVID, but today's modern retail environment going forward, and what's different?
Bernard Leblanc 30:02
I think, Michael, I'm going to, I'm going to hope that you, your post-COVID statement is true.
Michael LeBlanc 30:09
You and me both.
Bernard Leblanc 30:09
So, I'm going to bank on that, that will be my good news of the day. If, if I can, if I can take your words as being true. I think that, you know, the pre-COVID, post-COVID era, one thing that, that, that happened clearly was an acceleration of e-commerce.
Bernard Leblanc 30:23
We all knew it was, you know, the, the, the investment in e-commerce was necessary. It, it just confirmed that strategy. We had already heavily invested in our, in our web infrastructure. We, we have an in-house team that does all of our web development, from photography, to copyright, to web, graphic design, and so on.
Bernard Leblanc 30:49
So, that all comes together in, in our own, with our own in-house teams. That the service journey, as well, how you, how you, how the experience comes to life online is extremely important. And, and you need infrastructure. So, we built a state-of-the-art automated facility, in order to be able to, to take on that, that increase in volume.
Michael LeBlanc 31:12
And that's open, now, right. Because the last time I spoke—
Bernard Leblanc 31:14
It is.
Michael LeBlanc 31:15
Right, that's—
Bernard Leblanc 31:15
Yes.
Michael LeBlanc 31:15
That's up and running. That's fantastic. Just—
Bernard Leblanc 31:17
It is.
Michael LeBlanc 31:18
The timing was about a year off, but—
Bernard Leblanc 31:21
Absolutely. You know, at the very beginning of COVID, it felt like the worst decision I had ever made, really. Because it was just, it was the biggest investment the—
Michael LeBlanc 31:29
Yeah, yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 31:30
Business had ever engaged in. And, you know, COVID hits, all of our expertise from the engineers that were, that were necessary to bring it to life from Europe, and from the United States, all had to head home.
Michael LeBlanc 31:43
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 31:44
We were trying to set up, you know, this mega infrastructure, a fully automated facility via zoom meetings. I, you know, I, I will counsel everyone that's listening to never do that. And so, it was, it was terrible timing. But, you know, so what, what initially seemed to be like the worst decision after the fact, it took about six weeks, right. From the time when we shut our stores down, to see a true acceleration in, in the web, it took about, you know, four to six weeks to start seeing a really high acceleration.
Bernard Leblanc 32:20
Very, and so, you know, our infrastructure was sufficiently in place to be able to respond to that increase in volume. So, that was, that was great news. And, and so today, we, we benefit from that infrastructure. So, that, that's certainly something that has changed. And our, and our web volume has dramatically advanced versus where it was, and what we were anticipating it to be.We are hitting volumes that were part of our 2025 business plan. So—
Michael LeBlanc 32:49
Wow.
Bernard Leblanc 32:49
You know, it was a really massive acceleration—
Michael LeBlanc 32:52
A great acceleration.
Bernard Leblanc 32:53
During COVID. And the nice thing now is that we're seeing that a big part of that web traffic is actually sticky, and, and, and was probably acquisition that we were able to do during COVID. So, that's, that's, that's a good element. I think some of the trend’s post, post-COVID is that perhaps a, a return to the, the interest or the demands on sustainability.
Bernard Leblanc 33:17
Making, you know, we have an industry, which still has a lot of work to do in terms of reducing the impact. We have our vision program that we've been working on for, for, for a few years already. Where, you know, the, we're engaging and using circular textiles, we're engaging in reducing water usage, reducing greenhouse gas emissions.
Bernard Leblanc 33:41
Just being more thoughtful, even social, you know, in terms of social impact, or economic impact, of our sourcing footprint. So, so those demands, I think, will, will accelerate post-COVID. And the reality is there's a massive talent crunch, as well, in, in—
Michael LeBlanc 33:56
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 33:56
The industry and just in the world in general. So—
Michael LeBlanc 33:59
That's not a short term, that's not a short-term issue, either. I did an interview with former Governor of the Bank of Canada, Stephen Poloz, who put out a new book and he said, listen, if you're thinking the labour crunch is a short-term phenomenon, it's, it's a global long run issue, right.
Michael LeBlanc 34:13
Which brings up issues of technology, and, I guess, it, it really, I guess, let me integrate it in to my last question, is, as, as you step into this new role, the challenges you face, you know, in a high service environment, you know, you can't really automate a great experience in-store with an associate and a customer, so these must be foremost in your mind, yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 34:33
Absolutely. The talent crunch is something we talk about daily. Combine that with an inflationary environment that we haven't seen for, for, you know, 40 plus years.
Michael LeBlanc 34:44
Generations, yeah, yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 34:45
And combined, as well, with very, very difficult supply chains. And, and changing, changing or, or evolving, customer trends that we, we, we have not, probably haven't seen where they're actually going to stabilize.
Michael LeBlanc 35:07
Yeah.
Bernard Leblanc 35:08
You know, we're just a few weeks out of COVID, if we're honest about it, and, and the reality is, yes, things are stabilizing. I, I feel good about the future of, of physical retail, frankly. I'm not as pessimistic as some relative to, you know, the death of the store and so on. I think there's a social aspect to shopping that, that will remain.
Michael LeBlanc 35:29
100%.
Bernard Leblanc 35:29
Yeah, there's an entertainment part to all of that, that you can't replace just—
Michael LeBlanc 35:33
Inspiration, all these things, right.
Bernard Leblanc 35:35
Yeah.
Michael LeBlanc 35:35
I mean, if shopping was just buying stuff, we'd all just do it online, right.
Bernard Leblanc 35:38
Right.
Michael LeBlanc 35:39
Because that's just the most efficient way to do it. But—
Bernard Leblanc 35:41
But how much time can you spend in your pajamas, right.
Michael LeBlanc 35:45
I've spent about enough, thank you. I think I'm, I think I'm ready to, to have a great retail shopping experience. And I know where I'm going to go to get it. Well, listen, Bernard, this has been a fantastic interview. I think we could talk for a long time about all the things that are happening in the industry.
Michael LeBlanc 35:59
And, but let's, let's stop it here. You've got a great, you know, you've got a great run ahead of you. I think it's a fantastic opportunity. And, and I want to thank you for making time to chat with me and I wish you continued success.
Bernard Leblanc 36:13
Well, thank you. I, I sincerely appreciate the opportunity. It was, it was a good chat. It, you know, brings, brings some of the thoughts back to the forefront, so always useful.
Michael LeBlanc 36:24
Thanks for tuning into this special episode of The Voice of Retail. If you haven't already, be sure and click and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform, so new episodes will land automatically, twice a week. And check out my other retail industry media properties, the Remarkable Retail podcast, Conversations with CommerceNext podcast, and The Food Professor podcast with Dr. Sylvain Charlebois.
Michael LeBlanc 36:44
Last but not least, if you're into barbecue, check out my all new YouTube BBQ show, Last Request Barbecue, with new episodes each and every week. I'm your host, Michael LeBlanc, president of M.E LeBlanc & Company, and Maven Media.
And if you're looking for more content or want to chat, follow me on LinkedIn or visit my website at meleblanc.co.
Have a safe week everyone.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
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