Ron Johnson is responsible for the iconic Apple Store and Genius Bar that are loved by retail specialists and consumers alike. After years of transforming the retail strategies for retailers Apple and Target, Ron is pioneering the next leap in the retail revolution: bringing the personalized e-commerce shopping experience from your screen to your doorstep. As the CEO of Enjoy, Ron says that the future of retail will take place in your living room. In this interview, Ron is back on the podcast talking about taking the next step in the shopping experience. We talk about what inspired this transformative approach to retail, and what impact it will have as Enjoy grows with their new partners.
Welcome to the The Voice of Retail , I’m your host Michael LeBlanc, and this podcast is brought to you in conjunction with Retail Council of Canada.
Ron Johnson is responsible for the iconic Apple Store and Genius Bar that are loved by retail specialists and consumers alike. After years of transforming the retail strategies for retailers Apple and Target, Ron is pioneering the next leap in the retail revolution: bringing the personalized e-commerce shopping experience from your screen to your doorstep.
As the CEO of Enjoy, Ron says that the future of retail will take place in your living room. In this interview, Ron is back on the podcast talking about taking the next step in the shopping experience. We talk about what inspired this transformative approach to retail, and what impact it will have as Enjoy grows with their new partners.
I ask Ron to call on his experience in traditional retail as well as with Enjoy to offer retailers key pieces of advice and insight on navigating the post-COVID world.
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I’m your host Michael LeBlanc, President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company, and if you’re looking for more content, or want to chat follow me on LinkedIn, or visit my website meleblanc.co!
Until next time, stay safe and have a great week!
Ron Johnson
Ron is the CEO and Co-Founder of Enjoy, the first mobile retail store. Enjoy has partnered with premier technology companies including AT&T, Rogers, and British Telecom to bring their products directly to customers. When a partner's customer purchases on-line, their product is hand delivered on-demand, with a trained Expert to get them up and running, answer any questions, and purchase any additional products, accessories, or software solutions. Under Ron's leadership, Enjoy has delivered more than one million Enjoy experiences and created a new channel in retail - the mobile store.
Ron is perhaps best known for the work he did creating and leading the Apple Stores during their first twelve years. Ron also served as the CEO of JCPenney during 2012 and 2013. Prior to his time at Apple Ron was highly regarded for the work he did as the merchant leader at Target Stores, the United States leading upscale Discount Stores. He helped the 1700 store Target chain differentiate itself through design and skillful marketing. Ron spent the majority of his 15 years at Target from 1984 through 2000 in merchandising leadership positions.
In addition, Ron is a Board Member of several private companies in the Bay Area.
Michael LeBlanc is the Founder & President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company Inc and a Senior Advisor to Retail Council of Canada as part of his advisory and consulting practice. He brings 25+ years of brand/retail/marketing & eCommerce leadership experience, and has been on the front lines of retail industry change for his entire career. Michael is the producer and host of a network of leading podcasts including Canada’s top retail industry podcast, The Voice of Retail, plus Global E-Commerce Tech Talks and The Food Professor with Dr. Sylvain Charlebois and the all new Conversations with CommerceNext podcast. You can learn more about Michael here or on LinkedIn.
Michael LeBlanc
Welcome to The Voice of Retail. I'm your host Michael LeBlanc. This podcast is brought to you in conjunction with Retail Council of Canada.
Ron Johnson is responsible for the iconic Apple Store and Genius Bar that are loved by retail specialists and consumers alike. After years of transforming the retail strategies for retailers like Apple and Target, Ron is pioneering the next leap in the retail revolution: bringing the personalized e-commerce shopping experience from your screen to your doorstep.
As the CEO of Enjoy, Ron says that the future of retail will take place in your living room. In this interview, Ron is back on the podcast talking about taking the next step in the shopping experience. We talk about what inspired this transformational approach to retail, and what impact it will have as Enjoy grows with our new partners.
I ask Ron to call on his experience in traditional retail as well as with Enjoy to offer retailers key pieces of advice and insight on navigating post-COVID world.
Ron Johnson
in physical stores, you've always had stores optimized for convenience, stores optimized for experience
Michael LeBlanc
Yep,
Ron Johnson
Right in the premium brands have tend to be optimized for experience. And the online world all you've had a stores opera-, optimized for convenience.
Michael LeBlanc
Let's listen in now. Ron, welcome back to The Voice of Retail podcast. How you doing this morning?
Ron Johnson
Oh, it's great to hear from you, again. I'm very excited read today in the New York Times that August 9, the border opens between Canada and the US. And I can't wait to get back to Canada. It's a great place and visit our business partners and spend time.
Michael LeBlanc
Well, it's been a long time that the world's longest undefended border has been closed. I mean, it's, it's so un-, you, like everything's unusual, right? And during this pandemic, but that's just been such, such a difference. So yeah, looking forward to it. And then I'm looking forward to, to the reciprocal, right, looking forward to go down to see all my business partners in the US real soon as well. I've actually just booked my NRF January show I, you know, I'm gonna go to the NRF this year, I just booked my hotel. I just went ahead and did it.
Ron Johnson
I'll tell you what, we're all learning to well, you know, obviously pandemics not over at all. In fact, it's still a very dangerous time, particularly for unvaccinated people.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
And we're finding that here in the US. But we are moving into what I like to think of as a series of next normal.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
And one of the next normals would be the chance to do cross border travel between the US and North America. And then the other big next norm will be, how do we return to work? How do you return to the office? And that's a big topic and a lot of people's minds.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah, I mean, I don't know what you think about lasting, and we'll get to this in the discussion, but lasting impacts of the COVID era, as I've called it. I mean, there's some things that were just temporary adjustments that we made to our lives. And then, I think often about what are these, what if anything, is permanent? And we'll get to that in terms of consumer behavior. But I think the, you know, the work from home movement was certainly there be pre-pandemic in the before time, it's not like the technology is new, but it just seems culturally that I've talked to many CEOs, retail CEOs, who, who would never think about hiring, like a Director or VP of Marketing that wasn't, you know, living and working in their office, but now that many of them are open to it, like it's cultural, right? Are you are you experiencing the same thing and your discussions with your counterparts?
Ron Johnson
Absolutely. It's, uh, I kind of feel like, you can now have a global talent pool for more positions. And, as long as you can make remote work, you're able to expand the number of people,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah
Ron Johnson
and the type of people you can record. And that's been a part of the valley here, in the Bay Area, I live in Palo Alto, as you know, I work in Palo Alto be because it's kind of the nature of what we do here. It's very expensive to live here. It's hard
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah
Ron Johnson
To get people to move here. But it's increasing. And so, if you look at Enjoy now, my CFO lives in Chicago, my Chief Administrative and PeopleSoft People Officer lives in Florida. My Chief Legal General Counsel lives in Atlanta and New York. My Chief Commercial Officer is in England.
Michael LeBlanc
Wow.
Ron Johnson
And so, we've got a very distributed team. And it's better because we can attract better people, and especially when you're trying to build as an example, diversity.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah.
Ron Johnson
When you try to hire diverse talent, you're already working with a kind of a smaller group. And you're recruiting and there are challenges with that, but it opens up the funnel and you can find better people. So, I embrace it personally. I think for some people, it would be slower though. They want
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah
Ron Johnson
To be in person and they like that way to work and some vary by company by leader etc.
Michael LeBlanc
Now thinking back on your decades of leadership, has it always been such for you? Or is this something that, that has come to you, perhaps as you, as you launched, Enjoy, or has the,
Ron Johnson
I'm kind of, I'm kind of, whether it's well regarded or not, I'm a person who tends to lean forward, tends to see around corners,
Michael LeBlanc
Right
Ron Johnson
Tend to be very comfortable going where, as your famous hockey player Wayne Gretzky would say where the puck is going.
Michael LeBlanc
Right on,
Ron Johnson
That's kind of my nature. So, I tend to lean in a lot earlier, to longer term trends. And so, I think in this one, I'm probably ahead of the game a little bit, but and hopefully I'm on the right path.
Michael LeBlanc
Well right on, right on. So, the last time, I was reflecting on the last time you and I spoke, I should say, welcome back this is your second time on the podcast. I was sitting in a hotel room in Dublin. And the last time we saw each other in person was in Montreal. I had had dinner with, with your friend Troy Dunn, who had come up to see you from, from an Apple, who you remember from Apple. So, it's been a while lots has happened. Why don't we start a little bit for the listeners who may not have heard the first, our first interview, a little bit of your background, and then a little bit, if not more, because we're gonna talk a lot about, about Enjoy, just outline that content for so.
Ron Johnson
Sure. So, I am a lifelong retail guy. I already, believe it or not, I'm in my early 60s. But I tend to think of myself as 58. Because, in Italy, for example, your age is your birth here. So, I'm always 58 the year I'm born.
Michael LeBlanc
Perfect
Ron Johnson
So, I'm 58. But I began,
Michael LeBlanc
Wait a minute, I'm 63 then, that go, that doesn't work for me,
Ron Johnson
Isn't it nice. It's a great thing. And it kind of I like that too, because it kind of quickly positions you, the generation you grew up in, which suddenly it gives you a perspective about that person. It isn't that they're old. They were born in the 50s. And they lived through the 60. I surely like it. But that's another topic another day. But no, I grew up and I went to Harvard Business School and I just wanted to be a retail guy. I just thought it'd be a great intr- industry. For me.
It's like sports. It's competitive. It's fast movin. it's people intensive. You can change things quickly. It's creative. It's about winning. And so, I joined the retail industry, I started at a company called Mervyn's, which was very successful had just been bought by Target Corp. I went to Target. I went to Apple. I went
Michael LeBlanc
(inaudible), change it there.
Ron Johnson
Then I founded Enjoy. So, I've done lots of things in,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah, yeah
Ron Johnson
My career.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah, yeah
Ron Johnson
Probably most noted for the work I did at Target where in the 90s, Target was really, like all the discounters, struggling to compete with Walmart, which
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
Had a huge advantage on cost structure, technology, and we shifted to win on design. And, and that helped Target become Target, along with great marketing,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
and yet,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah, yeah
Ron Johnson
And to this day target in the US is never been better. There are over $100 billion market cap, it's tripled during the pandemic and
Michael LeBlanc
They really hit their you know, when I look at numbers, even ecommerce numbers, they really hit their stride. I look at growth percentage year over year, and as amongst the, their counterparts, they grew more. And I think it's you know, clever design. I also think they made some smart decisions around shipped. And so, they've really did you know, they're really done well.
Ron Johnson
You know, they chose the power of great leadership because four years ago, their CEO, Brian Cornell laid out a vision that he was going
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah
Ron Johnson
Invest $7 billion in the physical stores, improving lighting and everything they do, but most importantly enabling the store to become the engine of ecommerce, meaning
Michael LeBlanc
Right
Ron Johnson
It's like a distribution center and then they acquired ship and they are going to work on speed for to the customer. People could pick up. And it, what's profound to me is there's all these systems now that you watch daily traffic, right? The most important thing about Target right now is its traffic is up double digits over 2019 in its stores while its ecommerce is growing faster than its competitors.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
And so, Target's hitting on all cylinders. But I was at Target in the 90s when it really developed its merchandising vision, its marketing vision. And now it's got great operations paired with that. I went to Apple in 2000. Imagine the retail stores and spent a dozen years on Apple's executive team working with, you know, Steve and Tim and,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
The whole team. during a period when Apple moved beyond the Mac, it launched the I-
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
Pod, the phone, the iPad, when it built out its retail stores. So, it changed how it connected with customers, it changed the product families. It was a great time for me. I went to JC Penney had a very challenging time trying to turn around a department,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
Store but then I'm doing kind of the culmination of my life work, I'm doing Enjoy right now, which is really fun.
Michael LeBlanc
Well, let's talk about Enjoy. I mean, the last time you and I spoke it was pretty early on in Enjoy. You weren't even in Canada yet at that time, you, that was yet to come. So, tell us, tell the listeners about Enjoy.
Ron Johnson
Yeah, it's really, it's really simple. I, like I said earlier, I kind of see the future and want to do it now. And what I saw, what I see is commerce has been moving to the home really rapidly for 30 years. We call it online shopping, because when it started in the 90s, principally by Amazon, you had to be at a computer to shop online, there were no smartphones,
Michael LeBlanc
Right
Ron Johnson
And very few people had internet connections at the home or had email. And so, they called it online shopping. It was for the 3% who happened to have, be tech savvy and be online, and they started with books. Well, the really the choice you are making is should I buy a book at home, or should I go to the store? It was commerce at home or commerce at store.
Michael LeBlanc
Yep.
Ron Johnson
It was interesting, in about 2011, I had a chance to meet Brian Chesky. in those early days of Airbnb, he's the founder, as you know. And he told me, he said, we're in breakfast in San Francisco. He said, Ron, 'My dream is to turn your home into a hotel', and the lights went on. That's commerce at home.
Michael LeBlanc
Right.
Ron Johnson
I instead of going to the hotel, I can go to a home. When I was in New York, and I met John Foley, who was early days of Peloton, and he said, in fact, 'My dream is to turn your home into an exercise studio'. So, instead of going to SoulCycle, I'd come to the home. And then hit me, well, maybe you could bring the entire store to the home,
Michael LeBlanc
Right.
Ron Johnson
Instead of getting to the door, what if you could go through the door and bring a full retail experience. So, Enjoy does that. We operate mobile retail stores for some of the world's best companies. And we could do everything you do in a store, everything. But I say better. Because when we come through the home, you're in your environment, you're comfortable. It's where you live your life. It's where all your products come together. It's unhurried, right. It's uninterrupted. It's a great environment to have a retail experience. And so, our partners, what we do is we operate stores for companies like Rogers in Canada.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah.
Ron Johnson
Throughout Canada, you know, increasingly throughout Canada, you can just go to Rogers.com, or go through their call center and book an appointment to have someone come to you and deliver a full retail experience.
Michael LeBlanc
It's so, you know what, I love the, I have always loved the idea. But you know, I'm a big Apple user, I've got everything Apple, and stitching it all together. And you know that there's so much, I figured out the basics, but I always know, you pick up tips, and I'm sure this is what some of the conversations in the home are, is 'Did you know you could do x?'
Ron Johnson
Right.
Michael LeBlanc
And what do you need it for? And,
Ron Johnson
Right
Michael LeBlanc
I know these things, this discovery process, not just the customer service, but the discovery process just feels to me like the right, as you say the right direction to go generally,
Ron Johnson
Yeah, it's particularly true, as you know, with a company like Apple.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
We now, I don't know if you know it Michael, we operate stores for Apple in the US. So,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
We just, you know, added Chicago last week, the DC Baltimore area and Atlanta to go with the West Coast, California and Texas. But it's, the perfect sample is an Apple experience at homes pretty cool. We deliver your product, we set it up, we activate it using the SIM card of your carrier of preference. We can take your trade-ins and give you value on the spot. You can buy anything you want that's in the driveway, because we have a mobile warehouse in the driveway, which is our mobile store. And we use a QR code and you just customize, you look at that website and go I like Airpods. But more importantly, we unlock services, that's really important. Apple, increasingly how you use your phone.
Ron Johnson
This this week, Ted Lasso,
Michael LeBlanc
That's right.
Ron Johnson
It's the number one Emmy decorated, or nominated comedy from last year.
Michael LeBlanc
Right
Ron Johnson
People can, we can get them set up for that so they can watch it on opening night and binge watch before. All that is a conversation, right?
Michael LeBlanc
Right.
Ron Johnson
And the, the drop off doesn't help with that. And so if you're a premium company and you want to engage with your customers, online commerce is actually a challenge versus,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
A store but that's the way the world's moving. So, if you want to win, you got to find a way to engage for a digital customer and that's what Enjoy specializes in.
Michael LeBlanc
Well, it's, it's a continuation on that spectrum. If the way I think of retail is bifurcating between, you know, experience and efficiency and as you say shopping online is very efficient. Gets it to your door quickly but the experience can be, can fall short. Now you've, one of the things that,
Ron Johnson
Yeah, but that's the big deal, right.
Michael LeBlanc
Right
Ron Johnson
So, in physical stores, you've always had stores optimized for convenience. Stores optimize for experience.
Michael LeBlanc
Yep.
Ron Johnson
Right in the premium brands have tend to be optimized for experience. And the online world, all you've had to stores opera-, optimized for convenience.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
So, all we're doing is bringing that same paradigm to the home. So, now you have a choice at home, do I want to deliver to the door or through the door? And you'll make those choices. And so, I see a world 10 years from now where most of what we buy will be convenience. That's kind of how we live our lives.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah.
Ron Johnson
But there'll be products for which we want more. And we'll invite someone through the door.
Michael LeBlanc
And, what brought us together today specifically, was some announcements you made about some financial investments in the organization that, that looks like it's going to take it to a new level. Talk about that a little bit.
Ron Johnson
Yeah, no, we're going public later this summer. And that will allow us to secure about $450 million of capital. So, we can expand faster globally, you know, we're operating now in Canada, the United Kingdom, the US. We have ambition to operate throughout the developed world, and explore new initiatives. And it's like anything, when you start on a journey, especially when you're doing something really new, there are a lot of paths you could take, and we
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah
Ron Johnson
Want to be well capitalized. So, we'll be going public. We've got a great sponsor, it's a company out of Chicago, you know, that all of you let, especially your list-, or listeners in Toronto will be familiar with. As you get to Chicago a lot. It's one of the big cities nearby and
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
But the Ricketts family out of Chicago, the Cubs
Michael LeBlanc
Oh yeah,
Ron Johnson
And along with a group from New York, but it's, they're great partner, so we'll do that sometime this summer.
Michael LeBlanc
Now, when you capitalize like that, what does that go into? Is that people, like is that trucks equipment? Is
Ron Johnson
Everything
Michael LeBlanc
Technology, everything, right?
Ron Johnson
Everything, no, it's more for us. It's, it's a little bit technology. Our headquarters group is about half engineering. And it's to continue to invent the mobile store, we want
Michael LeBlanc
Right,
Ron Johnson
To be faster. You know, right now, we're really fast. But we want to be the absolute fastest way you can get a product. I think there'll be a day when we are, have inventory within 15 minutes of the customer for every product you might want to buy. That's pretty fast.
Michael LeBlanc
That's pretty fast, until you invent teleporting, but maybe that's on your roadmap,
Ron Johnson
No, but you know, we're really close to that, believe it or not, that's gonna take a lot of engineering.
Michael LeBlanc
That's true.
Ron Johnson
But then we're gonna invent, it's gonna help us be better. And, but it also helps us grow. So we,
Michael LeBlanc
Right,
Ron Johnson
We will open up in, you know, additional countries, probably in 2023, maybe a little sooner, but we'll see. And it's good to have good capital.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
It's also good to have a strong balance sheet when you work with the world's biggest companies. So,
Michael LeBlanc
Right,
Ron Johnson
Apples got a lot of cash last time I looked at their balance.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah, they've done well, they've done well,
Ron Johnson
Well they generate a billion dollars of cash a week or more. So, we're only going to raise 450 million. That's like three days of Apple's work.
Michael LeBlanc
It's crazy. I mean, that their free cash flow, it's just you know, what they shut off in free cash flow.
Ron Johnson
(inaudible) on the balance sheet, three days of Apple's cash generation. So obviously, you can't support a company like that.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
Without a strong balance sheet.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah, right on. Shifting gears a bit, I wanted to tap into both your experience recently at Enjoy and your experience as a retailer just to help us understand what the, what the heck just happened. We were talking, we were talking off mic, you know, the pandemic isn't over yet. But we're in definitely in a new phase,
Ron Johnson
Yeah
Michael LeBlanc
Thanks to the miracle of vaccine. I mean, as I've described it, we can see the goalposts, or we can see the end zone but the goalposts keep moving a bit. But what, with such change, two questions, one, how did you manage with Enjoy? I mean, that's in the home, that that must have been a challenge, in that you had to work, I imagine. And then, as you reflect on this with your background, and do we have any sense, or do you have any sense of of what just happened? I mean, you and I, if we were sitting together, over dinner, we would be thrilled to move a percentage point, percentage share, but we've seen like 30 and 40% consumer changes. So, how do you view what just what just happened?
Ron Johnson
Well, we just got teleported five years. I mean, you think about it, basically, the long-term trends that were inevitable, people were starting more online, tired, retailers would have to close because they were going to be out competed. And they didn't have good balance sheets. We basically moved from 2019 to 2024 overnight, and we're now at a phase of commerce at home and store-based commerce that's probably would have taken a little longer to get to, but that's the fundamental change. And customer's habits changed. But the big thing here is, and we talked about all the time you read it, you want to change a habit takes about 21 days of,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
(Inaudible) behavior. Well, we were forced to live at home, work from home,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
Shop from home, get food delivered at home, we couldn't go out,
Michael LeBlanc
Play at home, online at home, everything, everything,
Ron Johnson
I think the habits aren't gone back, right. And so, the trends that we always talked about, we talked about before, for a store to compete, you got to do something more than convenience. So,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
Then the transaction, you got to build an experience. So, the companies that are thriving, were further down that curve. And people want to get out. I mean, they're going out,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Ron Johnson
You know, it's hard. You go to the shopping mall, on the weekend, it's hard to find parking. People are out, they're being social. You know, we, in New York, they call it for the young kids, what are the kids call it? The, I can't remember. But it's, it's this big time for them to get out and have fun, and they're all moving to New York. And one of the hardest things to do now is to rent an apartment in New York and
Michael LeBlanc
Crazy right?
Ron Johnson
Now the world's changed, but I think fundamentally, we just accelerated five years ahead and so the businesses that had started, you know, a lot of the delivery companies, the DoorDashes, they've accelerated, you know, Ubers, accelerated shift, it now does more deliveries, and it does rides. You know, there's just a lot of change. Enjoy has a bigger opportunity, because commerce at home is going to become a bigger deal faster. There was a great acceleration,
Michael LeBlanc
I have to think that a couple of big trends also play in that favor, so to speak, which is work from home.
Ron Johnson
Right?
Michael LeBlanc
We talked about that the beginning. I mean, I think it's pretty clear, like a linear connection that when you work from home, you do more shopping either locally or from home.
Ron Johnson
Yeah
Michael LeBlanc
And then the, you know, this, the second thing is, you know, as you say, you know, Ontario, where I am, just came out of 150 days of store lockdowns,
Ron Johnson
Wow
Michael LeBlanc
And people are just, you know, 150 days for what they call non-essential in Ontario, which is like apparel, basically. So, imagine that people are rushing back to the stores, but I feel it's a bit of a phantom. In other words, people are going to rush back. And then, you know, just to reassert their lives again, to feel normal, but then I think it'll come back to, you know, 'Oh, yeah, I think I want to go back home again', like, it feels like, we're gonna have this wave of nostalgia almost. But then it goes back to the home, are you, the US is a bit ahead of that. And you work around the world, and
Ron Johnson
You rush to the store, which is great.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah.
Ron Johnson
But then you have zero tolerance for a bad experience,
Michael LeBlanc
Right.
Ron Johnson
Because you realize how convenient it is at home.
Michael LeBlanc
Right.
Ron Johnson
And so, the customer is much more discerning. And, and unfortunately, when I go through stores, the tired retailers actually look more tired. You know, it's been 18 months, those stores didn't get freshened up very much,
Michael LeBlanc
Right?
Ron Johnson
You know, the merchandise in the stores is actually very light. If you look at inventory, and you look at specialty apparel, part of that's the logistics challenges of the pandemic.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
But people are short in inventory. Most retailers, when business gets tough, and during the pandemic was tough, their volumes dropped, they tend to get safer, so they don't invest in fashion. And so, you go to the store, and you actually, I think a lot of people while it's fun to be out, you're kind of disappointed in what you discover. I hate to say though, I'm not a negative person. But that's the lens I see it through. And so, I think that's part of the challenge for retailers is they just don't look great right now. Now, there's exceptions to that, like Target looks better than it ever has. But remember, they were an essential that,
Michael LeBlanc
That's right
Ron Johnson
Ploughed through the thing. And so the essential retailers really got an advantage, because they didn't have to close.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah, that that arbitrary distinction was really painful for many I mean, in some provinces in Canada, they said everyone can open but you can only have 10 or 20% capacity, which felt more fair to everyone.
Ron Johnson
Right,
Michael LeBlanc
Ontario took a different path and said, 'You know, you're closed, you're open' so you had big retailers.
Ron Johnson
Yeah, but these are tough decisions for government,
Michael LeBlanc
Oh, very tough. Yeah, yeah.
Ron Johnson
I don't envy the people that have to make it. Even now.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
You know, people, there's a whole decision. Should you mandate a vaccine? should you have,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
A vaccine passports. These get into very tricky is obviously for the safety and health of the world. You should have vaccine mandates and passports.
Michael LeBlanc
How are you, how are you handling that on the doorstep?
Ron Johnson
We don't Well, we, we use an honor code. So, our employees all have to submit into Enjoy. I'm vaccinated, I'm not, I don't want to disclose. And then people that are not vaccinated, don't want to disclose have to wear masks. We know who they are blah, blah, blah. If you haven't disclosed, we'll assume you're not vaccinated. And,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
We're doing that for safety. And then we wouldn't go through the door without a mask unless the customer invited us in. And we we're vaccinated. You know, so we're all trying to develop, you know,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah, yeah,
Ron Johnson
Protocols on how you do it. But, it's a complicated thing. But clearly, if you were focused on safety and World health, you would mandate a vaccine, but it kind of goes counter to how a lot of people believe right now, where we believe we ought to have a lot of freedom to make these decisions. And you got to respect people's rights to have their own opinion. So, it's,
Michael LeBlanc
Interesting. Well, listen, it's, I mean, it's deeply connected to your, to your style of business. So it's, I'm sure you, you guys put a lot of thought into it. And what's next? I mean, we've talked basically about what's next in a broader sense, you've got more capital to work, global expansion, you know, on the list of one, two or three, you've got opportunities, which ones are you focused on? first, second, and third, how do you look at that?
Ron Johnson
Yeah, first, first, second, and third is to just do a great job for Rogers, Apple, AT&T, our current customers, we've got huge runway with every partner, because we're a new idea.
Michael LeBlanc
Right.
Ron Johnson
Most people have never heard of us and, and we want to become a significant part of how they serve their customers. So that's job number one. And job number two is to add partners in related categories. You know, I think there's a tendency to want to move too fast. You know, we get approached, in the last week I've been approached, had conversations about six different industries wondering, would commerce at homework for us. From luxury apparel, to automotive, to cryptocurrency. You know, it's endless because people know what we're doing. And the answer is, yes, it would work for the premium companies for most. But that doesn't mean it's the right thing to pursue, because you can get distracted, pretty easy.
Ron Johnson
So, what I'm actually focused on, why don't end and I'll just tell you what we're doing on returning to work.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah.
Ron Johnson
So, we're gonna open up our office in September. But we're taking kind of a different tact. We think remote work, worked really well. It was great for our team. They loved the time they had and the freedom they had to work from home. And so, rather than rushing back to the office as a ritual, we're going to continue to embrace remote work. But we are going to pick one day, when if you live in the Bay area near the office, you're within an hour, we want you to come to work on Wednesdays. And that's because the big miss was culture.
Michael LeBlanc
Sure,
Ron Johnson
It was that human connection. It was hard for new employees to welcome them with the company to meet people face to face. So, we're gonna make Wednesday, our day at the office, and we're gonna make it a special day, we're going to start with an all hands in person.
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
It will broadcast live to people who are remote. We'll have a great team lunch could be outdoors here, because it's nice, you know, most
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
Days unless it's raining,
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
We're gonna have one of the groups, could be engineering, present what they're working on. It's gonna be a no meeting day, where you just do your own work. And if you want to say hi to someone do it. Because we're worried about that, you know, I'm, I'm in the office in the meeting, but I'm remote and how do you navigate that?
Michael LeBlanc
Yeah,
Ron Johnson
We're gonna invest one day in our human connection, and hopefully do a better job in one day than we used to do in five days without intention. But that will give us the freedom to let people to continue enjoy working from home. We estimated adds for about half our employees 15 hours back to their personal life. Yeah, like, it's probably true in Toronto, too. I'm,
Michael LeBlanc
Sure,
Ron Johnson
A lot of people will commute an hour to work.
Michael LeBlanc
Yep.
Ron Johnson
And you take the prep time, and you want to make sure you're on time. So, you plan an hour and a half.
Michael LeBlanc
Yep,
Ron Johnson
That's three hours in a day. That's 15 hours a week, well, that's pretty much your evening, five days a week, you're doubling the time people have to spend with family and friends and their own personal health and their own hobbies and, and so that's what we're doing. So, we look at the office as a resource, just like your personal computer is or your cell phone is and, and we're going to treat it that way. So if it helps you do your best work, office is always open, come on in, come in Wednesday, we're going to build the team. But other than that, we're gonna work remotely.
Michael LeBlanc
Well, it's no surprise innovative approach. It's a really great to, a great, this great discussion and a great way to end the podcast interview because we've talked to you know, in the full spectrum, the opportunities and your, your vision and your success. So, thank you for joining me back on to The Voice of Retail. And I wish you continued success and, and I look forward to seeing you in person someday soon, here in Toronto now that now that we can traverse, so it's great news.
Ron Johnson
Thank you. It's always nice to spend time with you. And I wish you the best as well.
Michael LeBlanc
Thanks for tuning into today's episode of The Voice of Retail. Be sure and follow the podcast on Apple, Spotify or wherever you enjoy podcasts so you don't miss out on the latest episodes, industry news and insights. If you enjoyed this episode, please consider leaving a rating and review as it really helps us grow so that we continue to get amazing guests onto the show.
Michael LeBlanc
I'm your host Michael LeBlanc, President of M.E. LeBlanc & Company Inc. And if you're looking for more content or want to chat, follow me on LinkedIn or visit my website at meleblanc.co.
Michael LeBlanc
Until next time, stay